Functional vs. Creative and Technical

[ed4644]

That is indeed a tough one....i guess i'll just be both. I want my cake and i wanna eat it too. Really it would be great to tap into both of those "parts" of the music scene. But I also believe you can be functional(laying down groove) and still be creative and technical(flurry of 32's). Gadd is the model student--so to speak-- for that. So is vinnie.

But these guys you mentioned are rare cases...the top dogs--the michael jordans of drums. Most people who are aspiring to become full-time professional musicians, like myself, will work on everything and anything to reach their goals. So what i'm saying is i'd be happy to do clinics, backup playing, sessions, (almost) anything in drums/music.

maybe my ramblings made sense.

[DrumKit_Cat]

I agree... I think for us non-A-listers, to make a living at it you would have to cover all the bases or certainly keep an ear to the ground for trends etc.

You can't be an e-type person being E-verything to E-verybody, but you should be an opportunist and capitalize on a situation.

hope that makes sense?!? ugh, I need more coffee.

[Andy Edwards]

My career has been strange in that after many years as a 'functional' drummer I got pulled into the clinic world here in the UK (and I have played with many of the players you mention.)

One thing I have realised is that it's all functional drumming.
When you do clinics you find the audience doesn't get stuff that is really hard to play and they are impressed a lot of the time by simpler stuff.

Someone like Thomas Lang has this down to an art. He plays incredibly difficult stuff but in a way that anyone can follow. This is why he has become such a force on the clinic scene.

But a lot of the things that work in commercial music. (groove, hooks, background story, status etc) have the same impact in the clinic world.

It's all about fulfilling the aesthetic criteria of any given sitution I think...

[Lee Collins]

Good posts. Btw, did andy mention he does clinics yet?? [img]graemlins/smarty.gif[/img]

I think all those different things would be fun but for me, I just aspire to have the best groove I can possibly lay down and enough chops to translate what's in my head to my hands.

As far as these great soloists like virgil who's whole being is about drum artistry, chops and manipulation of time, etc it doesn't appeal to me enough to want to focus so much on drum soloing. I'd get bored. It's great to check out these guys solos, I love to hear them. But to be 'a virtuoso soloist' nah, I couldn't really care less. I think that's because the real buzz, the real euphoria fix, is in the music, not the drums alone.

[Vdrummer]

Good point, Andy. The venue determines what might be considered functional. Drum clinics are somewhat artificial environments, but give us a great opportunity hear a drummer push his envelope. Given a choice between the two, functional - no question. I'm always surprised that there are so many amateur/semi-pro drummers out there with impressive technique but have a terminal lack of taste or groove. Ideally, we'd all blend the two, favoring the grooving side foremost.

That said, I like to push my technical limitations, working phrasing and groove interdependence when I practice. When I play the nutty stuff at a gig, I want it to sound good, not nutty. I love that look from a band mate that says "that was cool", and hate the "Was that a mistake?" or "What planet are you from?" look.

[Groovesmitty]

The Jojo Mayer comments have led me to create this thread.

There are so many great drummers out there that have amazing technique, good time, and free solo ideas. They do clinics, teach, and sometimes tour and/or record in the "A" list music scene. I include drummers like Thomas Lang, Virgil Donati, and Jojo Mayer in this group.

Then you have the drummers that only really play music. Meaning with other musicians. They play the right part for the song, lay down a nice dirty pocket, and have enough technique to execute their ideas. Shawn Pelton, Abe Jr, Russ Miller, Jim Keltner, and more.

Of course there are the few in between, who jump between scenes. They are session players that play on radio singles, yet do fusion/jazz gigs as well. Gadd, Colaiuta, Omar Hakim, Steve Jordan, Steve Hass, Gary Novack, and a few others whom I can't remember.

Which do you aspire to be? A functional drummer, who makes a great living without family assistance, playing on major tours and recordings, or the 32nd note double bass playing clinician who lives mostly off of endorsements and clinics?

Obviously I am not including the great jazz drummers in this.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 24, 2005 12:13 PM: Message edited by: Groovesmitty ]</font>

[Riddim]

"Which do you aspire to be? A functional drummer, who makes a great living without family assistance, playing on major tours and recordings, or the 32nd note double bass playing clinician who lives mostly off of endorsements and clinics?"

Hopefully a musical one.

One need not necessarily exclude the other. It's just a question, as Andy and others have said, of playing the right stuff at the right place and time.

Facility without musicality is like being John Holmes without a girlfriend.

[Andy Edwards]

Rudy_ment.

I only mention I do clinics because I assume nobody knows and that my my opinions might be coloured from my experience.
(perhaps it does come across like self promotion <sorry> but in reality you will find many posts here by people describing what they do. But if you say you do clinics it's like a red rag to bull for most drummers. I've probably ended up doing them because I'm a half good public speaker!)

I used to think that clinicians were all about '32nd notes on the double pedal' but the fact is most of the guys mentioned in the first paragraph have done as much 'functional drumming' as anyone else.

So my basic point is that this division between technicians/clinicians and REAL drummers is a bit false.
It's just another gig.

[Lee Collins]

Oh andy, I'm sure you realise I was just pullin yer leg mate! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
I know what you meant in your post and I generally like reading your posts as they have depth to them giving me something to think about over a coffee [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Andy Edwards]

Hello Rudy_ment.

I thought that, it's difficult to know how you come across in forums. I have quite a dry sense of humor and a lot of what I say is a bit tongue in cheek.

But back to the point, the reason I mention my experience is that I have jammed many a time with guys like Marco and Thomas and all I can say is they are REALLY great players and seem to me to cover all bases more than adequately!!!

The idea that they are a seperate breed from Tony, Vinnie and Gadd seems nuts to me. They are just really great players. They are different however, their groove and aesthetic choices are different.
I think this is a good thing.

What does worry me is how drummers have elevated the technical aspects of playing (and in this I include groove as well as speed).
I think the most important aspect of a player is their personality (eg Buddy, Moonie, Ringo) This I feel makes great records.

Music needs a kick in the ass!

When was the last time you heard a record where the drumming had some sort individuality? (White Stripes?)

Maybe it's time to move away from not only the 'technique for it's own sake' players but also the generic 'rent a groovers'